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Subject: Roland - emulate or innovate?


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Original Message 1/73                 Date: 03-May-02  @  11:49 PM   -   Roland - emulate or innovate?

panama

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ever since the Super Saw was created with the JP-800 - dance music has changed... Ever since the Grooveboxes were created... It's now a household name.

is Roland still the innovater?



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Message 2/73                 Date: 04-May-02  @  12:01 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

steve

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I think more important things have happened in the past few years than supersaws and grooveboxes to be alyou do have a point, although whether that has more to do with roland being a corporate giant and holding more sway than anyone else as opposed to any innovation on their part is a different question altogether.

god, I can talk some complete bollocks sometimes  



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Message 3/73                 Date: 04-May-02  @  12:03 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

steve

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the wucking fanker that I am: "...and grooveboxes to be honest. although you do have a point...."

god knows how I managed that one, I definately typed it out.



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Message 4/73                 Date: 06-May-02  @  09:24 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Zink

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Roland VP9000.

It's unique. I like it.

 



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Message 5/73                 Date: 06-May-02  @  09:48 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

proximus

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My father worked in a gear shack in the 80's and he told me that they had a machine which did what the VP9000 does..

my father could be wrong...



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Message 6/73                 Date: 06-May-02  @  10:35 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

sitarsong

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I'm thinking that the new innovators are companies like Native Instruments. Time will tell what impact they have.



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Message 7/73                 Date: 06-May-02  @  11:54 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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fuck roland.



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Message 8/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  02:28 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Zink...

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Oooohh!

Influx!

Did you discover that BT is a major Shareholder in Roland or summink???

;) <---Naughty, silly Michael.

I think software shows the most innovation. Actually that and the Neuron. Seen that Neuron??? It seems like a really cool concept, but they demo's I've heard are a little sucky. And it's expensive. Doesn't matter though, does it? Everything comes at a price.

Pro tools is innovative, isn't it?


 

Michael.



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Message 9/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  04:41 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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my dislike for roland has nothing to do with BT (altho it is for the same reasons which I have no intention of laying down once again because all you commercial fucks will just poke fun at me so ptooey)

oh...Jupiter6/8..>SICK<



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Message 10/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  04:08 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

damballah

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gosh, I don't think I have enough brain cells left to ponder such a weighty issue, panama. I do know they haven't made anything I thought I really had to have since a decade that started with an 8. hock-tooey.



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Message 11/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  06:56 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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NI have just opened US offices!

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 12/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  07:51 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

sitar

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Wow that's cool! I'll have to find out where. Probably not in nyc. I hope Absynth PC gets shipped over here soon. Maybe they brought some over on the boat with them.



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Message 13/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  08:49 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

xoxos

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is that why everythnig they've made since then has an 8 in the name?



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Message 14/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  09:33 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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haha. trying to regain their youth!



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Message 15/73                 Date: 07-May-02  @  09:56 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

99devils

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Every piece of Roland gear I've played has bored me stiff..



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Message 16/73                 Date: 10-May-02  @  05:05 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

errata

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I used to have an XP80... it did what it was supposed to do and little else. The RPS triggering was buggy as hell but it was all right. Not very exciting.

Roland makes crap now. Nothing works as it should and it's all cheap! Don't even SAY 505 to me. I work with a guy who had one. He sold it and says one day he'll buy another, so he can piss on it! Terrible company with terrible products...

errata



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Message 17/73                 Date: 11-May-02  @  06:43 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Brett

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not to be racist, cause I am far from it, but the focus of asian producers of just about every product, has always been, make what exist better. they are not innovators but refiners of things. Their cars have a European flare, there electronics have always tried to match that of the american and German high-end products. their synths were reactionary to things being done by germans and americans. I think their designs are innovative; technology wise, but from a creative stand point they have always just been behind the true innivators. the Japanese made musical instruments a mass market thing, when before they were always a custom built thing.

roland stuff was , in my opinion the best stuff to ever be made for dance music, but it was never the first. They just took other ideas and refined them.

The groove stuff is all crap IMO. The filters on the 303,505, 305 are crap, and the sounds are stock pcm. They are notorius for hype. Roland sells hype, not quality equiptment like they used to.



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Message 18/73                 Date: 13-May-02  @  05:42 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

swanofnever

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hmm... well, i'd agree with you if it wasn't for the small fact that japan is the ONLY major "non-western" socio/political power.

i'd say that's pretty damn innovative -- too bad the "underdevelloped" countries receiving US "aid" aren't all as innovative.



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Message 19/73                 Date: 13-May-02  @  07:03 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

realtrance

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Hey Brett,

That was pretty racist and ignorant of you.

The Japanese beat the entire US auto industry _cold_ in the '70s and '80s by, er, making cars that, what, oh yeah: work. Quality control is still light years ahead on any Japanese car over the American equivalent, step inside one of each and if you can't tell diff. in quality you should, well, er, just go buy a Ford Exploder.

In the musical instrument/synthesis arena, Roland was doing high-quality modular synthesis while the rest of the world was still digging peat out of the bog to cook dinner with. Roland had stable oscillators long before that long-sought-for goal ever came to light elsewhere. Korg had many innovations as well. Yamaha, ditto. Can you say DX7? Where were all those brilliant American dim bulbs when the Japanese saw fit to license the work being done at Stanford?

And oh, er, forgot to mention, the Japanese are light-years ahead of us in supercomputing now.

As well as the fact that the Japanese have brought SIMD to the mass-market while the brilliant Americans are still struggling with segmented-memory Neolithic X86 architecture (PS2 vs. Xbox).

Jeez! what an ignorant comment you made there!

Try reading, you may find you enjoy it, even just as a part-time hobby.

rt



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Message 20/73                 Date: 13-May-02  @  07:07 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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realtrance..did you HAVE TO say racist? How the FUCK was what Brett said racist?

in many ways he is right. They are imitators (and they usually improve things drastically!)

but...damn...racist? how the hell did you come up with that? just because someone mentions a certain group and points out characteristics theyre racist?

give me a break



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Message 21/73                 Date: 13-May-02  @  07:24 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Maarten

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Some people here seem to jump at the opportunity (spelling?) to accuse someone of being rascist, sick.
BTW, 'bout the filters... please stress 'MC' when saying 303.

Thank you.



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Message 22/73                 Date: 13-May-02  @  09:29 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

knowa

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oh jeez...we have to be able to make generalizations about groups of people without worrying that we're gonna sound "racist". throwing that word around just makes people scared to say what's on their mind. that's no good.

I have close friends who ARE japanese and have actually told me the same thing that brett wrote. now, whether or not he is correct is another story (what's the TB 303 and copy of?), but his statement was hardly hateful or anything.

my wife's Korean friends named their dog "roland" in honor of the legendary beatboxes...my wife usually calls him "loland". big trouble with l's and r's. and that's funny, dammit. no harm done.

lighten up. there are plenty of other ways to gang up on brett ;)



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Message 23/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  08:49 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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hey brett hows that protools rig?

I guess as D said it Roland sorta stopped being innovative back in the juno/jupiter/TR days?

was there some hypercreative design group behind that stuff?

Damn..time for a history lesson. Wheres the old men? Damballah? Pongoid (wait..hes younger than me) MINDSPAWN?!?!?! 

xoxos?



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Message 24/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  03:02 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Def Z

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The Japanese auto manufacturors benefitted from HUGE subsities in order to flood the American market with cars. While not worrying about remaining solvent, the Japanese auto manufacturors were able to focus on building a production line that was easier to retool in order to make quality changes while in the middle of a production. The American auto industry suffers because of it's desire to remain solvent, and because of a very strong labor union that is resistant to change of any kind.

Hey RT. Shut the up. It really pisses me off when people do what you do. If you feel you have differing information - present it without the insults. Why is it so difficult for people to have a discussion and share information without getting their panties in a knot?



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Message 25/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  03:06 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Def Z

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And no, I am NO fan of the American auto industry.

But bear in mind that the Pacific Rim countries that are exploding into the American auto and consumer electronis market are heavily supported by their governments. To my knowledge, the Japanese government doesn't do it as much as they used to, but the Koreans are building products with little regard for profitability. Whether that is right or wrong is a different discussion.

I think Roland has done a little bit of both. And I think the groove-machines are TOTALLY innovative. Developing a user friendly front-end has created a musical revolution, no doubt about it. And even if they weren't the first ones to do it - they brought it to the mass-market. That is certainly something.



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Message 26/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  09:07 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

swanofnever

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oh, typical -- it's fine if your low-business-taxes (aka 3rd world living standards) allow YOUR corporations to be more profitable and thus flourish/invade the rest of the world, but the second some other country follows suit (in their own way) you get all defensive and stuff.

what's wrong with government subsities? not "fair"? i don't really see the difference between the two approaches; it's just a question of how the businesses receive the money. DIRECTLY from the gov (given to the business via subsity) or INDIRECTLY from the gov (not taken from the gov via low taxes).



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Message 27/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  09:11 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

swanofnever

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"the Koreans are building products with little regard for profitability. Whether that is right or wrong is a different discussion. "

i just don't see where right and wrong enter into it... so now it's wrong to NOT be motivated be profits? why? cause it doesn't fit into YOUR (country's) "philosophy"? why not just ban all trade with other countries?



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Message 28/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  09:15 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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ok. sounds like a good idea to me 



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Message 29/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  09:19 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

swanofnever

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well, you know my motto... "if it worked for the USSR..."



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Message 30/73                 Date: 14-May-02  @  11:17 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

damballah

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well if you believe that, I know where you can get some russian analog synths...



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Message 31/73                 Date: 15-May-02  @  12:00 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

damballah

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anyway, it seems a lot of their "innovating" happened not through some grand Roland scheme but because of what some people did with their funny little toy-like boxes. what we now think of as legendary, was viewed then as sort of silly stuff you could abuse in interesting but unintended ways. no what u bich.



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Message 32/73                 Date: 15-May-02  @  12:04 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

realtrance

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Ooh! Where?! Do they use Svetlana tubes for the oscs?

I know it's nice to make generalizations, but I don't think it's any better to say that "the Japanese are just great imitators and have no creativity" than to say that "the Jews are all money grubbers" or that "the Irish are all drunkards." "Rednecks in the South marry their sisters." etc.

I consider all of those above generalizations offensive, that's the long and short of it. And I don't appreciate people slingin' _any_ of 'em around, or a host like 'em. That's, er.... racist, basically. Sorry. But it is. Or the equivalent (anti-Semitic, prejudiced against the Irish, rednecks, etc.).

rt



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Message 33/73                 Date: 15-May-02  @  12:39 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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actually, no. that is NOT racism. Prejudice, yes, stereotyping, yes but not racism.

'sides...man..are you really one of those oversensitive PC types that cringes at the mere mention of race? Bretts post was clearly not from that angle, and you just flipped out about it with the blah blah blah racist shit

sure...the belief that one group is superior is a little ridiculous, and harmful actions based on that belief are unacceptable, but saying a certain group tends to behave in a certain manner, well...perfectly valid!

stereotypes DO have a foundation, you know.



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Message 34/73                 Date: 15-May-02  @  05:20 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

knowa

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I dunno rt, there's a difference between saying some group has no creativity and is just a bunch of imitators and saying that they tend to focus on refining existing products rather than developing new ones...it just didn't seem mean-spirited is what I'm saying.

pony slaystation.



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Message 35/73                 Date: 15-May-02  @  10:33 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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well, it is a typical thing for westerners to describe/dismiss the japanese with that old 'they steal ideas and dont create' thing - which is rich coming from a culture (europe) entirely founded on the development of mathmatics, psychology, astronomy & all the sciences taken directly from the east. - it works both ways.... they are hard fuckers the Nip's... AND it's the second biggest music market after USA i beleive too... bigger than all of europe sales.

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 36/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  12:25 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

sitar

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Reminds me of the son of a redneck that tells his dad he wants to date a girl from school but he's a bit nervous cuz she's a virgin. The father says to his son, "Son, if'n she aint good nuff for her famly she aint good nuff fer arz."

I'll grab my hat.



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Message 37/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  01:23 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

steve

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[image file]


what?



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Message 38/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  03:36 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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Engrish.. heh heh... Bluce Wirris-a desu !

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 39/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  08:12 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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hehe. Kilo..you just called em Nips! now RT is REALLY gonna get you, and god forbid RHYZE reads it!!!!

oh dude...steve...engrish! Off to have a raff!



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Message 40/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  08:36 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

knowa

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I've gotta CD with "Fry me to the Moon" on it ;)

I always thought this was adorable...I ended up marrying one of my engrish students.



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Message 41/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  08:57 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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why?... British we call ourselves 'Brits' - Nippon-ese are 'Nips' - it's just short for Nippon.

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 42/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  09:23 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

knowa

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kilo you ignorant bastard; it's "persons of british descent" ;p

actually "nips" is considered offensive in the US, I think b/c it was common during WWII when they were rather unpopular here. so is "japs", not to be confused with "JAPS", the acronym, which is also officially "offensive" though rather useful in the NY area.



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Message 43/73                 Date: 16-May-02  @  09:53 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

99devils

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Yes, in our PC universe both "jap" and "nip" are considered offensive.



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Message 44/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  12:20 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

steve

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there used to be this chippy in tintown where the girl behind the counter would ask you if you wanted your chips 'open or wap?'.

You have no idea how funny it was to say 'wap please' when you were drunk.

fuckit, sitars taken my hat.



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Message 45/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  01:05 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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lol!... fuck i dunno, it's difficult cos the local guy in the corner shop is always telling me to get a nice 'Paki' girlfreind... and refer's to all his bredren as 'Paki's'... he's quite sweet & makes me laff cos he's ruffty-tuffty teenager and always in fights and generaly machoman with a huge much-older brother who shouts at him alot, so round the shop and his peers he's cock of the walk, then he'll sorta walk up the road with me away from the shop engrossing me in some banal conversation about (usualy) Kung-Fu movies, and after we're a few hundred yards up the road he'll say in this hushed, totaly innocent genuine voice: "so when such and such happens to a girl in such and such a place... what does it mean?" - and other such 'sexual advice' delicacies... makes me fuckin chuckle anyway... lol!.. he's got a good heart... its this peer pressure tho, they have to front everyone in the manor out of course, and yet he's so innocently brought up...

anyways.. i dunno the connotations of names... Nip's, Argies, Scot's... but some names work with an 's' and other don't, that's the thing... you can't say for brazilians... Bra's ! - ?? - 'Those fucking Crazy Brazilians', yes!!!.. it perfectly describes Brazilians !!  

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 46/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  02:12 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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dunno...people need to lighten up and focus intention on the CONTENT or intent behind a term

I call asians charlie sometimes. Anyone wanna jump on me for that one? seems reasonable



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Message 47/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  02:57 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Def Z

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The thing that gets me, is the same people who are usually up in arms about Japs, Nips, etc, are the ones laughing at red-neck jokes, or saying how much I hate "such-and-such" (fill with any political or non-oppressed group). Rich people, republicans, liberals, etc. Just listen to yourselves once in a while and you'll pick up on it.

Oh, you'll say, it's okay to make fun of rich people because...

Oh, it's okay, they're just rednecks.

Oh, it's okay, they're just Jewish.

See? One of those statements doesn't sound right. But what's the difference?



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Message 48/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  09:58 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

bedwyr

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the welsh are all a bunch of sheep shaggers, it's always raining, we only talk welsh the instant you walk in the pub, we all live in valleys and we're crap at rugby.


no, hold on, let me think about that last one again ...



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Message 49/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  01:03 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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true... it IS always raining!! (and they're crap at rugby)



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Message 50/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  08:17 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

realtrance

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I hereby resign my temporarily instated authority as Prejudice Police in the Dancetech Forum.

I just live by the motto, "commit random acts of unpleasantness."

I like to make people uncomfortable every now and then, when they're sliding into the all-too-easy-to-say slurs.

It's one thing to make an occasional joke with seeming-prejudicial overtones, when it's clear you're just playing around. It's another thing to throw a slur as part of an at least semi-serious discussion.

Okay, taking purple and yellow uniform off.... have fun!

rt



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Message 51/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  09:36 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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DZ there is a difference between pointing out innate characteristics IE "race" (which I have to say I firmly believe that there is no such thing as different "races") and pointing out cultural characteristics

but..not 'all' of ANY 'group' will be have the same..so...



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Message 52/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  10:44 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

bedwyr

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americans are all money grabbing arseholes and the english are a bunch of public school poofs. and they've both got an over inflated sense of they're own importance.

the dutch are a bunch of crazy dope smokers and the austrians are just a load of nazis.



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Message 53/73                 Date: 17-May-02  @  11:30 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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Q. What do you call an australian wearing a tie?

A. bar manager

 

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 54/73                 Date: 18-May-02  @  12:04 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

frostbyte

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k, ever read hanif kureishi's The Buddha of suburbia ? hilarious novel, the life of a young paki'in the mid/end 70's. a must read, loved it.



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Message 55/73                 Date: 18-May-02  @  09:07 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

proximus

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I think the issue with the Roland v-drums and spectrasonic stinks.. it's just a set of samples!! synthesis my 'grandpa'!!

I guess most of you have read it..
http://sound-on-sound2.infopop.net/2/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=215094572&f=884099644&m=2883073704

I know it has been posted before..

Roland innovative? I'm definately selling my mc-303 now   hehe.. no, I'm keeping it. I was positively surprised the other day when I toyed with it again.. mm, very nice drum samples. Who needs V-drums anyway?  



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Message 56/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  02:57 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Mindspawn

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Innovation, like a lot of other shit mentioned on this thread, is, as we've seen from the posts, VERY subjective.....

Influx - you sayin' I'm old you young buck?=)

Anyhoos, damballah is spot on about the release of the various boxes. Stuff like the Arps and Moogs were always pretty nifty, but in the 80s you had a bunch of stuff come out that really didna have much of a market at the time. I mean the first time I saw a TB303 (83-84?), the music store fella called it a replacement bassist... He turned it on and played a few very lame sounds and I walked off chuckling that no one in their right mind was gonna pay $350 for that crap.... those words have haunted me a lot in the past few years...=)

The Junos were pretty cool, more so when the whole alternative/new wave thing hit. But the real shit in the 80s seemed to be the Roland D50 and the Yammy DX7. ROMplers were THE rage in the mid-late 80s. I think if there was a time when Roland was generally thought of as innovative at the time of a release, it was probably with the ROMplers, LA synthesis, etc...

An' then it happened. Some crazy fool went and tweaked the knobs on the 303 and the rest is history....



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Message 57/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  06:43 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Brett

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Influx, protools is moving slow, I am just getting caught up with my old debt. I should be on track by end of summer with the PT.I think i'll be plenty happy with Cubase sx. I may just wait a until PTmix24 is much cheaper next year.

Even the juno was the japanese answer to the prohpet5. The 303 was pretty out there. I have to say it was inovative, but there were allready other accompanymetn devices being made, drum and bass. What the 303 bcame was just a fluke. Look at what is coming out of China now. Damn good mics. I got a studio projects c1, thing sounds so damn good. But as usual, it's a knock of the Nuemann u87. As for automobile development, that is funny, most Japanese asthetic designers go to the school in cali to study , and the engineers are prodominantly educated here in the states. I saw a show on the dicovery channel with he head of Nissan talking about how they develop new cars. American ideas influence them so much, as well as European philosophy and engineering methods.


and to end, Realrtrance, you make it really easy to prove a point when say stuff like this

"Where were all those brilliant American dim bulbs when the Japanese saw fit to license the work being done at Stanford? "

last I checked, Stanford wasn't in Japan!

they took an idea or concept from somewhere else and made it theirs. It's what they do. They rarly take on the role of vangaurd in a market segament(very smart) and instead learn from the mistakes of the early entrees and come in with a better product at a lower price. It's not racism, it's Economics on a very academic level.



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Message 58/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  09:45 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

bedwyr

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dunno much about norwegians, maybe i should ask some finnish people but they're just a bunch of nazi collaborators.

who else? canadians ... hehehe



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Message 59/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  02:30 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

damballah

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oh right. blame canada.



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Message 60/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  03:46 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

xoxos

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on japanese is it appropriating ideas or studying history so as not to repeat it? music & technology different.



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Message 61/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  05:36 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Pongoid

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Oh yeah? Well check this out. FUCK YOU ALL! WHY descriminate? I hate you all, as well as myself, and at times strongly sympathise with Nobody's view, save for the fact that I have not yet lost faith, and have seen that we can be so much more than we are. We are all humans, participating in a very destructive system, and as long as we continue and do not try to change, or moreover succeed in changing this shitty system in which we all live and perpetuate, we are ALL shit factories, and deserve much more abuse than any of us here receive, and thus any of these pathetic offences that we feel directed at us by personal circumstances rather than action, should be cherished as one cherishes each prod of a dentist's pick on a cavity, reminding us that we are alive, and continue to make life worse for all other life on this planet, and soon maybe elsewhere as well unless we change our ways. The insults for our foolish actions should generate yet more shame, shattering mirrors, and drawing the ridicule of all the natural world upon us, tht we might try harder and think our actions through a bit more. Imagine a time when men loved the world and it loved them back, albeit in a hard way, when all political decisions were based not on the next quarter's profits for the shareholders, but SEVEN GENERATIONS welfares. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Make things happen or enjoy the shitty diapers of your life, and may your children enjoy the fruits of your efforts or lack thereof as well. You have more power to change than you realise. Wake up and change the world, even just a little, or enjoy the piece of shit you see in the mirror. I know I don't.

Ape



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Message 62/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  06:19 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Brett

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uh ...ok.



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Message 63/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  07:35 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Pongoid

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PS, fuck Roland too. They spend so much on advertising that when they do actually take a step forward, like the VP-9000, it's super expensive, and worse than their fucking s760 to try to figure out. I HATE ROLAND OS's. They could spend less on tree-wasteful ad-magazines, and more on development of a simple, comprehensive OS that would make their litte innovations sell like hotcakes. As for their pieces of shit like the SH-32, they should stick the components into something more useful for musicians, and less garbage for simply catering to wanna-be's. Instead of raising the standards of music, they kill it, and really help divide the camps of folks who can afford decent technology, with either Daddy's pocket money or the studio's budget, and the folks who can't afford good tools, and won't get any better quickly because of the limitations set on them by low-budget tools. Fuck Roland in the ass.



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Message 64/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  08:39 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

xoxos

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let me guess pongoid, you're back in the states aren't you



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Message 65/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  08:41 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

xoxos

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and ehre's a nice link for ya



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Message 66/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  10:20 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Mindspawn

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While I would be happy to join the "kill all humans' ranks, it's not worth my trouble. The breeding will continue, the sore will fester, life goes on or it don't. No reason to get yer panties in a bind.... No, I don't fugging care, and yes, "I" am the reason the world is so fucked (a weak human perception), AND I dunna care. I've removed myself from the gene pool, so I really have no stake in this one way or the other... so mayhap I "should" (according to people who can't deal with differing opinions) shut the fuck up... Just find me a Notron for shit's sake...



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Message 67/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  10:31 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

k

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but the v-drums main thing is the actual kit which is superb.

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 68/73                 Date: 19-May-02  @  11:53 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

influx

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ahahahaha!!!

Pongoid, dude...the venom in your responses is shocking sometimes. Its like you dont even need a trigger youre just walking around PISSED OFF

cant say I dont empthize, but...just seems directly DISproportionate sometimes.



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Message 69/73                 Date: 20-May-02  @  01:16 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

realtrance

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Pongoid,

I disagree w/your opinion on the SH-32; it's a wonderful little box.

Roland's OSes are a little like Wordstar, they make ABSOLUTELY no sense initially but prove brilliantly efficient and logical once you really get to the point of mastering the instrument.

The only stupid thing I've seen, in my opinion, is, why oh why did they leave a numeric keypad off the XV-5080?! I mean, on the XP-80 you can go _anywhere_ in a huge sample bank in seconds with a numeric keypad; obviously that was too much fun so they left everyone with a push-knob to work with instead on their top-o'-the-line synth.

Oh well, everyone has a problem. Mine is I'm too old to enjoy a banana fudge sundae any more without consquences worse than going on a drinking binge. If that were different, I'd be a whole different person. Oh well.

VP9000 is going for pastry cakes these days, is it any worth looking at? I'm assuming Roland will have wised up and maybe planned to put a filter and a coupla more voices on it for a new release some day....

rt



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Message 70/73                 Date: 22-May-02  @  04:35 PM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Brett

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sh-32 ? it's just like the other mc-505, mc-303. It's roland trying to cash in on somthing they got right 20 years ago without delivering the same level of quality. they make great Drum sets, and even guitar related products. The vs2480 looks powerful. It's the so called Groove stuff they throw together. It's designed and driven by the marketing guys, not the musicians and technitians. The old gear in the 80's was designed for pop and rock. the dance music functionality of it was just dumb luck. So now that they are making stuff specifically for dance, it doesn't have the same level of quality associated with it, and that is why Roland can go to hell. If the sh-32 has any of the atributes of the mc-boxes, I feel pitty on those foolish enough to purchase one.



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Message 71/73                 Date: 23-May-02  @  12:52 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

brentym

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"...let me guess pongoid, you're back in the states aren't you..."

that was funny.

try a new vanilla coke!



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Message 72/73                 Date: 23-May-02  @  01:08 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

Pongoid

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I did. They are disgusting. Yes I am.



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Message 73/73                 Date: 23-May-02  @  01:49 AM   -   RE: Roland - emulate or innovate?

nothingnewhere

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what? vanilla coke? sounds terrible.

i like old roland. except my srv-3030, which i also like. i guess its just the instruments that they make now that suck.



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