Original Message 1/11                 Date: 18-Mar-02  @  04:40 PM   -   shelf eq'ing on tracks

Ghost

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hey all...


I have a song that gets real busy toward the end and it sounds all mushy... the top end doesn't cut through - there's a lot of sounds competing for space...

I read that some ppl take each track and hi and lo-pass it to center kind of a bell curve on just the audible frequencies for the track....

is that worth the time and effort? (I would have to do it offline since VST doesn't have shelf EQ)

I realize that I will need to do more EQ while all the tracks are playing together to really solve all my problems, but I was wondering if any of you routinely did that kind of shelving EQ to help out, or as a starting point.....


also, would I lose anything by doing that? I always hear that those upper inaudible frequencies add to a mix, so am I going to lose something there? or will some of those freq's be replaced by decaying reverb?


any EQ tips/advice appreciated....
thanks!!

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Message 2/11                 Date: 18-Mar-02  @  04:47 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

steve

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I can`t say too much on the technical side, as I can`t really mix meself but are you sure VST doesn`t have shelving eq? Its been a while but I thought the low and tops eq sections had little buttons or something to allow you to select either shelving or bellshape?

For what its worth, I normally shelve off some of the lowend on bass and hats etc. as a matter of course and then only do so on other stuff if I can hear definate problems.

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Message 3/11                 Date: 18-Mar-02  @  05:15 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

Ghost

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I'm still at VST 3.7r2... no shelf.

ugh. I won't even mention my PII.

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Message 4/11                 Date: 18-Mar-02  @  09:29 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

Brett B

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yes shelving does help. You are in essence highpass/lowpass filtering out the harmonics that bleed into the other frequency ranges. Overdoing it can result in the loss of impact a track has though. Aslo eq's add some distorion to the track and may attenuate the frequencies on the edge of the curve just like any other filter, except they are non-resonant.

Try using the shelving on fx returns to clean up reverb as well. some pros use the reverb mono as well over the stereo option. But the mudd can definatly be helped by removing these low-mid bass harmoonics out of strings and synth parts and open up the bottom for better bass and kick drum imaging. It goes beyond just shelving, but also boosting and cutting frequecies using notches or narrow bells as well. If it sounds good, do it. Don't worry about rules.

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Message 5/11                 Date: 18-Mar-02  @  09:29 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

horizens

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at first i would say try not to have too many
parts in the same range playing at the same
time. what about using less sounds or picking
sounds that don't interfere with one another? if
you really must have them all, then here are
some eq and multiband compression tips:

EQ Frequencies

9KHz-15KHz:
Adding will give sparkle, shimmer, bring out
details. Cutting will smooth out harshness,
and darken the mix. Common processing:
Very little compression, add/reduce gain for
timbral shaping.

6KHz-15kHz:
Air and presence. Common processing: Slight
gain boost.

4KHz-9KHz:
Brightness, presence, definition, sibilance,
high frequency distortion. Common
processing: Compression to reduce
sibilance/HF distortion. Add (gain) brightness
or liveliness to a mix.

5Khz-7KHz:
De-essing. Narrow band compression.

800Hz-4KHz:
Edge, clarity, harshness, defines timbre.
Common processing: gain reduction to
reduce harshness.

200Hz-1.5KHz:
Punch, fatness, impact. Common processing:
Compression and gain boost.

150Hz-400Hz:
Boxiness. Common processing: Reduce gain
to remove 'mud'.

200Hz-below:
Bottom. Common processing: Compression
to tighten a boomy bass sound.

Example Settings for a Multi-Band
Compressor (5-Band)

LOW - tighten up bottom end.
Frequency Range: 0Hz-150Hz
Ratio: 2.5:1
Attack: 20ms
Release: 150ms
Threshold: very low to almost always trigger
compression.
Gain: make up gain lost in compression.

LOW MID - tighten up the mix.
Frequency Range: 150Hz-600Hz
Ratio: 3:1
Attack: 20ms
Release: 150ms
Threshold: trigger regularly, but be about 2dB
below the point of rarely triggering.
Gain: make up for compression, or just a little
more for warmth.

MID - add punch to the mix.
Frequency Range: 600Hz-1.5Hz
Ratio: 6:1
Attack: 10ms
Release: 150ms
Threshold: set fairly low to almost always
trigger compression.
Gain: add 4-6dB or more to make up lost gain
and add guts.

MID HI - add presence and increased clarity of
individual instruments.
Frequency Range: 1.5KHz-6Hz
Ratio: 3:1
Attack: 10ms
Release: 150ms
Threshold: trigger regularly, but be about 2dB
below the point of rarely triggering.
Gain: add 1-3dB for presence/clarity.

HI - reduce harshness without losing sparkle
Frequency Range: 6KHz-15Hz
Ratio: 2:1
Attack: 10ms
Release: 150ms
Threshold: only trigger when harshness
present.
Gain: maybe add 1-2dB to recover sparkle lost
in compression.

Gain after each band of compression can be
used to shape the sound.

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Message 6/11                 Date: 19-Mar-02  @  01:01 AM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

Brett B

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I see you using compression, but in many cases expansion is needed to quiet parts that are too loud and need dynamics to still remain after gain reduction. You can use a little expansion to decrease the RMS of a bass but retain its peaks and thus open up the mix more for the other parts.

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Message 7/11                 Date: 19-Mar-02  @  03:36 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

Ghost

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thanks Brett and horizens.... great tips!

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Message 8/11                 Date: 19-Mar-02  @  04:51 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

Pongoid

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Damn horizens, nice formula. Not gospel, but damn good advice.


Ape

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Message 9/11                 Date: 19-Mar-02  @  08:38 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

horizens

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oh, i hope you guys don't think i came up with
that!

 

that's from snipwarp. pretty good stuff.

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Message 10/11                 Date: 19-Mar-02  @  09:41 PM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

knowa

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and he's modest too! nice, thanks horizens.

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Message 11/11                 Date: 20-Mar-02  @  01:10 AM   -   RE: shelf eq'ing on tracks

Brett B

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maybe I could use that if I could figure out ratio realease and attack on the ME compressor. It has in, out and gain on the curve and gain on the eq-band graph?

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