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Subject: what mixer should i buy?


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Original Message 1/29                 Date: 07-Apr-01  @  02:09 PM   -   what mixer should i buy?

kef

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hi
im trying to decide what mixer to buy and i hope you can help me out. i want to have at least 8 channels, at least three effect loops and three mic amps and 3band eq with mid sweep. what alternatives are there and in what price range? any help would be much appreciated.

by the way, why are the behringer mixers so cheap? do they suck or are they just cheap?

kef



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Message 2/29                 Date: 07-Apr-01  @  06:52 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

gb

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Get a 01v if you can afford it.



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Message 3/29                 Date: 08-Apr-01  @  12:00 AM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

influx

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alesis studio32 if you cant.

you should buy more channels than you need right now...odds are youll expand at some point and then youll have to buy another mixer. plan ahead.

as for options..youre on the net..do some research 



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Message 4/29                 Date: 08-Apr-01  @  01:26 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Moujik

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Take a look at the new Spirit M series - look pretty good, but havent heard of anyone whos using them yet...



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Message 5/29                 Date: 08-Apr-01  @  01:59 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

kef

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i recently checked the mackie 1202 VLZ out. it is fairly cheap, has a total of 12 mono inputs (i think that'll be enough) but no mid sweep and only 2 aux sends. is there any smart way, other than aux sends, to route effects?

I found on the mackie homepage that the 1202 VLZ has "Extra ALT 3-4 stereo bus for submixes, separate recording, monitor and 'mix minus' feeds". What does that mean?
Maybe some of you have got a 1202 VLZ? What do you think of it?

thanks for your previous answers and sorry for not knowing anything
kef



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Message 6/29                 Date: 09-Apr-01  @  02:10 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Defector Z

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Check out Allen&Heath. More expensive, but I think they have smaller boards with sweepable mids. They are more expensive than Mackie's, but seriously high quality and a great sound.

http://www.allen-heath.com/product/prdfrm.htm



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Message 7/29                 Date: 09-Apr-01  @  10:59 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

mikec

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You see? Do you? Even Defector agrees.

;)

MikeC



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Message 8/29                 Date: 10-Apr-01  @  12:59 AM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

k

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but... watch out & test the board first before purchase cos some of the A&H budget mixers click when you mute channels with the channel mutes -

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!



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Message 9/29                 Date: 10-Apr-01  @  12:47 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Milan

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Get a digital one, preferably Yamaha if u can afford it, you get compressors, effects, the whole deal...
i love my Promix01 which is now dirt cheap.



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Message 10/29                 Date: 10-Apr-01  @  02:57 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

99devils

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A Tascam TMD-1000 will get you into digital mixing for $499.

-Craig



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Message 11/29                 Date: 10-Apr-01  @  04:06 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

mhutchison

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I hear people suggesting the Yamaha 01V - how can you suggest a mixer with only 20 bit d/a, a/d?

The roland vm3100 v mixing station is 24 bit and half the price. Granted you have fewer channels and effects, but how can yamaha say they have premier sound when they are working in 20 bit?



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Message 12/29                 Date: 10-Apr-01  @  07:36 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

damballah

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because that's ad copy and they're not going to move as many units by saying anything but "we've got the hottest shit on the whole freakin planet". It's not like it matters with dance music, anyway. I have a feeling by the time most electronic-music 'producers' stick a 10:1 compressor on every channel and then compress the whole mix as well, the final result is probably closer to an 8-bit file.



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Message 13/29                 Date: 10-Apr-01  @  10:16 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

mikec

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Don't listen to numbers. Although I'll tell why not with a bunch of numbers. ;)

16-bit numbers give values from 0-65535 (actually usually read as -32768 to 32767 for samples, but that's irrelevant). Every time you add another bit to the number size, the total range doubles. A 17-bit number gives 0-131071, an 18-bit number gives 0-262143, and so on.

The final output of your music will be 16-bit. The reason that processors work in higher bit ranges is because if you restrict your calculations to 16-bit then your sounds are very likely to clip before you get the final result. So you have to scale everything down before you calculate and then go back up again after you've got the answer, thus losing some resolution.

It's much better to leave the original values as they are, do the calculation and then scale down to 16-bit.

The fact is that the difference between 20-bit and 24-bit isn't really a great deal as both ranges give a sizable enough value for you not to really lose too much resolution in the calculations.

The more the merrier of course, but in this case, 20-bit is easily enough, presuming they've done the corresponding maths functions (there are many different ways to do the same thing) so that the values don't exceed the 20-bit range (which of course they must have).

In summary...don't listen to numbers. A bigger number does not equal better performance in all (most?) cases.

And the O1V's are great.  

MikeC



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Message 14/29                 Date: 11-Apr-01  @  08:30 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

99devils

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OK, here's a bunch of reasons to go for an 01V over a VM-3100 Pro

EQ: 4-band 44-bit fully parametric EQs vs 3-band EQs in the Roland (website didn't say if all bands were fully parametric or not)

Compression: 22 full-blown dynamics processors vs. 2 compressors, plus you could configure your FX processors as 2 more for a total of 4

Mic Pre's: 16 on the 01V vs. 2 on the VM-3100

Some other things I couldn't find info on: Motorized faders, routing, channel swapping, dedicated controls for the EQ.. The screen looks bigger on the Yamaha. Not to mention that Yamaha consoles like the 03D and 02R are standards in studios everywhere while Roland consoles are.. umm.. well, nowhere.

Granted the Roland is a few hundred less, and it's a good competitor to the Tascam TMD-1000, and the pro is in a price segment that is somewhere between the Tascam and the 01V, but the claim that because it's 24 bit vs 20 bit that the 01V is somehow inferior is ludicrous.

-Craig



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Message 15/29                 Date: 11-Apr-01  @  10:33 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

gb

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And, the 01v is easy to understand and the manual is excellent.



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Message 16/29                 Date: 14-Apr-01  @  05:48 AM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

PointBeing

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2^n where n is the number of bits gives the range.

 

hey what is 1.0 times 1.0 a few billion times? it isnt 1.0 dont you love computers? round off error, i love you



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Message 17/29                 Date: 15-Apr-01  @  01:02 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Milan

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there you go now, (allmost) everyone loves a Yamaha  ) Get one from easter bunny now! greets chums.



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Message 18/29                 Date: 16-Apr-01  @  08:49 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

shoebox_b

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I read somewhere that the quality of the 01v is similar to that of an old four track. I hope this is not true as I was thinking of buying one at a really good price. I hate to use the word "pro" but the piece I read inferred that the o1v falls way below pro standards.



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Message 19/29                 Date: 16-Apr-01  @  09:10 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

pict

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An old studer 4 track quality maybe but not portastudio 4 track quality .



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Message 20/29                 Date: 16-Apr-01  @  09:16 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

99devils

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Yeah, I don't know where you heard that but it's absolute rubbish. Perhaps you were reading about the Promix01? I've heard lots of badmouthing of that particular mixer but never the 01V. Sound quality is fine, and it's as quiet as death. You simply can't beat the amount of power this mixer puts into your hands for $1500ish.



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Message 21/29                 Date: 17-Apr-01  @  08:03 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

gb

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I agree with Craig - the sound quality is excellent.



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Message 22/29                 Date: 17-Apr-01  @  09:18 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

pict

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The Promix is not a bad mixer it was a breakthrough mixer and got fabulous reviews from all the music press and a host of pro musicians.The 01v is another step forward but it doesn't mean that the Promix is a dog a few anecdotes about supposed reliability or build quality issues aren't enough to dissuade me from recommending one
or ignoring it's virtues.I'd still unquestionably recommend an 01v over a promix but for someone without the money the promix is still a good and useful mixer.Personally I much prefer analogue mixing.



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Message 23/29                 Date: 17-Apr-01  @  09:57 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Milan

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pict, i too prefer analogue mixing, but wait
until you start doing automation on a digital
desk, from realtime volume fades to modulating fx
and eq´s in realtime, not even a 1.000.000$
analogue desk like Neve can do that!
trust me, i was lucky enough to work with those
too...



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Message 24/29                 Date: 17-Apr-01  @  11:11 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

pict

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I agree Milan automation is the main feature of digital desks imo sure.If you can afford a Neve I'm sure you can afford a few extra hands to do it the old fashioned way though.



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Message 25/29                 Date: 17-Apr-01  @  11:23 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Milan

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HAHA pict, dont i wish i could afford one!
but i DID get to work with one, and on the
mixdown it was me runing around turning all the knobs and aux sends to get "special" effects  



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Message 26/29                 Date: 17-Apr-01  @  11:25 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Milan

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Lee Perry Style man !
the desk is my instrument  



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Message 27/29                 Date: 26-Apr-01  @  10:29 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

Pongoid

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How many of you have tried to bring a O1v out live? Travel with one? Fly with one? Out of the digital boards, yes it is my choice too, but not to travel with. I'll stick with my 1202 vlz for live stuff, thanks. Bigger, warmer easier sounding. Easier to replace as well. O1v is not a beginners' board.

Ape



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Message 28/29                 Date: 27-Apr-01  @  02:30 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

99devils

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I've brought my 01V out to location recording sessions, it's not too bad. If you have a decent case for it I don't see why there'd be a problem. However, I think I'd rather gig with a cheaper mixer than risk destroying my 01V.

-Craig



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Message 29/29                 Date: 27-Apr-01  @  08:35 PM   -   RE: what mixer should i buy?

infrasound

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playing live isn`t a consideration for a lot of people when choosing a desk tho to be honest. Besides which, those little Mackies are so cheap now 2nd hand, its not too much of a burden to pick one of those up as well. Would function nicely for use as some efx returns in the studio too  

Anyway, the 01v - just good vfm really in a nice compact space. I`m not blown away by any aspect of it bar its use as a midi controller but its just nice all round really, doesn`t put a foot wrong in any area bar the midi spec of the efx. I



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