Original Message 1/19                 Date: 09-Apr-00  @  03:34 PM   -   Dynamics, dynamics,dynamics.....

lastmanstanding

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If anyone needs some tips let me know.... I've been playing real (yes real!!)drums for some years now. And I've also been sequencing. First things first, learn the accents!!! I've heard so much techno that sounds stiff & has no dynamics. And make it busy, you can still have that generic techno sound, but make it have a cool flavor. Something different now & then. Please....I'm so bored with so much stuff that people think is cool, and anyone w/ a sequencer & a drum machine can make up in about 2 minutes.......

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Message 2/19                 Date: 09-Apr-00  @  03:39 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

unknown_talent

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It's just rebirth, BUT have a listen and gimme some good advise and stuff I could make better.

HTTP://www.mp3.com/unknown_talent

I'd apreciate it bigtime ;)

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Message 3/19                 Date: 10-Apr-00  @  10:13 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

Jasper

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Well if you really want to make an impact on our techno rythms (btw I know what your talking about with the accents), why not put that drumming skill to good use and come up with some nice un-rigid patterns we can use.

I for one could use a bit of inspiration and someone elses hi-hat pattern with feel usually does the trick.. However they are hard to come by (good ones), we've all seen the shite techno.mid hardhouse.mid which is basically kick,hihat,clap in the typical bang tsh clap, style.

I've got this well funky one I'm using at the moment from cakewalk, the swing.dna file is great.

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Message 4/19                 Date: 10-Apr-00  @  11:10 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

ModAsBlue

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I just want to say that some kinds of techno are meant to be stiff, jerky. That's what makes it techno and not tek-house, you know? I don't know what you cats listen to but there is so much diversity out there that people often generalize about what should be what and how this and that should sound.

If you listen to guys like T-1000, his hard-minimal shite is just POUND CLOSED-HAT (reverbed)

like, nothing else, it's all in the synths.

Any drumcode track is much more (hence the name) drum-oriented and those cats really know how to program drums...

Tech=house like middle-school detroit shit (stacey pullen "Ritual Beating System" relies heavily on bad-ass accenting, manual quantize-tweaking (I mean, this is before groove templates or anything...he did this shit by making a 1.01.48 into a 1.01.46 by ear).

A lot of my rock-friends who only like the Crystal Method listen to my Tresor albums and are like "this is stupid" and utter that perennial complaint of "anybody with a drum machine could do that" ...

NOOO!!!!! If you say so, then do it. I give them a cracked rebirth and they come up with SHIT SHIT SHIT that is only a caricature of what they heard and a REALLY BAD caricature with no art.

Listen to Frankie Bones. On some tracks you think, "god, this guy has no fucking talent" but if you've heard his middle school shit (1994-96ish) you know that he can produce some bomb as shit...and then his stupid shit grows on you as you really listen to the details.

A lot of Techno is as much, if not more about sound creation and timbre and mixing than it is about "oh, hell yeah, I've got this bomb ass 'groovy' drumtrack"

SOme people need to get out of the studio and into the clubs more...remember where you came from and remember what makes you into a trainspotter, bobbing your head up front and jumping with the candy-ravers as you give each other a special eye-contact indicating "yes, I understand this set...this is it, right now...Terry Mullen is the headliner, and he's fun and all, but this guy, with his dj haircut and roman nose, sweatin his ass off, this guy is spinning the innovative shit...THIS is future music and I'm not on any pills and I wish I could capture this moment and show it to people..."

And it's usually forgotten when the 4 am disco house starts and everybody is dancing to the funky samples of the past. The future is forgotten by then...

I LOVE DISCO HOUSE and all, but ... hey...

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Message 5/19                 Date: 11-Apr-00  @  03:36 AM   -   Yeah, techno.

Jasper

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Dave Clark - Fuse. Mix.
Richie Hawtin - Decks, FX, and a 909. Mix.

My top played cd's at the moment, some really nice rhythms going on there.

Yeah some techno IS supposed to be rigid, like if you just pull the last but one 1/16th hihat on a pattern, just one step back to the previous 1/16th then the whole loop get this jerk at the end. Like.

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Message 6/19                 Date: 12-Apr-00  @  01:03 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

damballah

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Ummmm... Do you mean techno as in "techno?" Or do you mean techno in the way some people who aren't versed in the nuances of the various subgenres of electronic music use "techno" as a rather derisive blanket term for everything from Tangerine Dream and Gary Numan to Portishead and Autechre? Because there are some styles in the latter definition that have more of the human qualities you crave. Although I know what you're saying on a certain level, what kind of rhythms would you use to back some Germans saying "we are the robots" through a vocoder? By all means, though, lead by example.

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Message 7/19                 Date: 13-Apr-00  @  12:15 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

ModAsBlue

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yeah yeah yeah! That would be in the subgenre of jerky-robot-phrase techno (i'm half=kidding)

Damballah, I mean techno as Techno. I'm one of those asshole purists who obsess over genre names. It's not so much that I need to classify things as they help people communicate: by all means, the fusion and extrapolation of genres leads to innovation but I still like to know what is "techno" proper or "tek-house" or "disco-dub" etc...

That Hawtin 909 album is ok but I'm absolutely entralled by the first two tracks. Simple, elegant but not booooooooring...

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Message 8/19                 Date: 13-Apr-00  @  05:09 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

Jasper

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So you like it a bit more laid back and spacious like?

It's about the only stuff you can write whilst stoned I reckon ;)

damballah - I'd chuck an awsome throbbing tribal rythm behind that, with a well bassy kick that has that overdrive shake (not distort). Really short and hard cl-hh on the offbeat. A reverse clap on the first offbeat tuned 1 down from the normal and overdriven forward clap on the 2nd on-beat. suck suck suck...

Then I'd bring in a short phase detuned ophh right on the last 1/16th before each beat hi-pass filterd to fuck. man I can't wait to get the micriwave2 cos that's what would come in next... really middly and power power POWER!!!!

shit shit shit, why am I at work????!!!!!

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Message 9/19                 Date: 13-Apr-00  @  09:02 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

damballah

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ModAsBlue: You're Lastmanstanding then? OK, I didn't get that. Detroit,hey -- yes, you'd know techno! It's just I've heard people I refer to just about anything with a synth or a drum machine as techno, as in "Why doncha listen to some real music instead of that damn techno" which gets 'em the middle finger salute damn near every time. Cool, then. You got any tracks?

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Message 10/19                 Date: 13-Apr-00  @  08:10 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

lastmanstanding

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I have some tracks, I will post them soon
Odd time anyone?? 3,5,7,11,13,15??

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Message 11/19                 Date: 13-Apr-00  @  10:21 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

ModAsBlue

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Uhh, no I'm not Lastmanstanding! But as I understand that he is a drummer I wish I were. (I was born with hesitant hands :-(

As for Detroit, well...

The scene that everyone worships is of the past, unfortunately. I am too young to have know it. One advantage, however, is that I've seen all the Detroit greats in some very intimate settings.

Carl Craig, Derrick May, Juan Atkins, Kevin Saunderson, Jeff Mills, Kenny Larkin...at least one of the above is around every month (cept for Mills...he had a big concert-type show that was cancelled recently for lack of ticket sales, can you believe it! everyone in Detroit pays at the door, I guess, because there definately was NOT a lack of INTEREST!)

Nowadays Detroit's scene is probably above average as far as the talent we get in, but that's most likely due to the size of the market. In a metro area of 5 Million (Detroit of course is ALL metro area and NO city because the city proper is like hell on earth...you have to have been there to know! It looks like post-apocalyptic ruin at 4am) there are plenty of rave kids to draw in. I'm not saying there are no rising stars, but only that it's not the wealth of innovation that it used to be. Finally, the RACE ISSUE fucks things up pretty bad on many levels.. Suburban whites (of which I am one) are probably far more racist than average...Oakland county is the 3rd richest county in the country but Wayne (Detroit) is probably among the poorest. And it all goes back to slavery...alas...

I ramble...

My tracks? I'm working on it. My biggest deficiency is in my incessant perfectionism. I so harsh a critic of others that I want my own work to be as good as possible before I ever post... I'm a big talker but a weasly little bastard!

BTW I do straight up techno that leans towards trance for some reason...I really hate trance proper but I think I lean trancy because of my previous musical background in indie rock...hmmm...who knows...I like pretty music...

ttyl

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Message 12/19                 Date: 13-Apr-00  @  11:43 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

lastmanstanding

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What are you talking about ModAsBlue???? Is this Jerry Springer or a music site???

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Message 13/19                 Date: 14-Apr-00  @  05:40 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

ModAsBlue

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Sorry...just explaining Detroit for the Joe who mentioned it...

Compress the shit out of this beat to get generic hard techno

(low threshold, high ratio)

I like about a -30db threshold and infinity to one ratio for the most obnoxious effect

yay

big deal

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Message 14/19                 Date: 14-Apr-00  @  05:41 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

Jasper

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It's sort of both, yeah post em up  .

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Message 15/19                 Date: 21-Apr-00  @  07:22 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

Pongoid

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Mod, you're a Detroit kid, and think the greats have passed? Mad Mike is still doing it quite well, as is Rolando, and I know Drexciya are still around (although sources say the new stuff isn't as cool as the old stuff was). Go to Submerge. It's still kickin.


Ape

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Message 16/19                 Date: 24-Apr-00  @  10:20 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

ModAsBlue

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Pongoid -

I've seen Rolando but I don't remember him at all...

The locals that stick out in my mind are Derek Plaslaiko and Kieth Kemp...they always impress me with totally solid REAL TECHNO sets...

Wilhelm K isn't bad for straight up house

Punisher used to do BAD ASS swedish sets

But the thing is...the scene is SOOOOO SCHETCHY that I don't even go anymore...it's not worth it...fuckin' junkies everywhere askin "you got pills? who's got pills????" (FUCK OFF!) and fucking shootings and cops and

eck...

I'm moving to Cleveland! CLEANER!!! (no, that's not like the MAIN reason I'm moving...but it's in the top five)

Oh and as far as production goes...well I'm not a DJ so I don't know a LOT of names...

However, the Innerzone Orchestra and Time/Space (the later seem to be Derrick May's proteges) are doing some wicked Jazz/Techno fusion...maybe that will spread...

I just bought this CD... "Comin From the D (troit)" of Detroit Ghetto tek and it totally didn't impress me...Punisher layed down this track that was probably just a sample ripped from HERE and repeated over and OVER and OVER and OVER again...

But she's as CUTE as they come, so she gets a record out, I guess.

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Message 17/19                 Date: 26-Apr-00  @  08:59 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

pulaski

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hi modasblue.

so you're from the detroit area... i recently have been exposed to some really great detroit stuff at this party in new york on saturdays called tru skul. they sorta specialize in bringing in djs from detroit and chicago, or at least with that "sound." heard some great sets from anthony shakir, robert hood, theo parrish, boo williams and TRAXX, who is just fucking insane (in a good way). it's a really intimate space with a pretty good vibe. no candy ravers, k-holers, etc. anyway, i'm glad i've been properly exposed to the detroit sound because i'm really feeling it. i particularly like stuff with that really minimalist, filtered percussion loopy kinda sound. i'm eager to hear/learn more. i'd like to incorporate this sound into music that i make. and i'd love to hear your stuff whenever you have something you'd want to share. sorry this post is sorta pointless. just wanted to share my enthusiasm. and hey, i come from a more indie-rockish background as well. still trying to find the link between heavenly and derrick may ;-)

ps. have you read that 'techno rebels' book by dan sicko? i thought it was pretty interesting

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Message 18/19                 Date: 26-Apr-00  @  10:25 PM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

ModAsBlue

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Woops...

Dude, that's tight as fuck. See, we don't even get that shit around here anymore...

I can't believe you saw TRAXX! I saw him once in my initial raver phase when it was all about taking as many pills as you could in a night. Then I bought a couple of his mix tapes and I LOVE that old-school rare-groove house shit he spins.

The last time I saw Derrick May he was spinning this very different shit...way more percussive than the normal "detroit" style...and very minimal but evolving. A lot of times its hard for me time find good "techno" CDs in music shops because of what my limited DETROIT perception of what techno is...

I can't really explain it...I have certain expectiations that are disappointed by guys like Luke Slater and Carl Cox.

ANyway...hey man, Brooklyn's gotta be pretty tight. I saw Adam X twicce in a span of a couple months and I really liked what he was doing...he has a mix CD on Wax Trax that's pretty decent but very unlike what he played when I saw him live (copyright clearance problems?)

Anyway, if you wanna talk techno...

modasblu@tir.com

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Message 19/19                 Date: 29-Apr-00  @  11:13 AM   -   RE: Get rid of the lame stuff.......

Pongoid

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Mod, sounds like things have gone even more to shit thatn they usually are there. Damn, dude. Sorry to hear that. New York's still got it kickin. Just played a really nice party last night. Set went well, the crowd went nuts, I'm happy. Don't know if I want to come play Detroit after a report like that. Shootings at parties? Don't know that I'm down with that. SO are you doing 'Detroit-ish' stuff?

Ape

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